After just eight weeks on the job, NPR’s new chief content officer Nadine Zylstra had big news to share: NPR had landed Machine Gods, the new video-first podcast from veteran tech journalists Casey Newton and Kevin Roose.
The deal, announced earlier this month, was something of a coup for NPR. Newton and Roose had announced they were leaving their podcast Hard Fork at The New York Times to build something independent. The news that their next show was headed to NPR, another legacy outlet, was greeted with some surprise — especially because NPR has been cutting jobs and offering buyouts in its first full year without federal funding.
“I don’t think NPR has been buying, is the bottom line,” Zylstra said about the surprised reaction. “I don’t think people thought we would be open to that kind of big swing.”
“Candidly, it’s been a tough year,” she added. “It’s not a shock that everyone would be like, ‘How are those guys doing? I hope they’re okay over there.’ But we really are.”
Zylstra told me she feels she’s been “training [her] whole life” for the job. (She said something similar when she was hired.) Zylstra works from NPR’s Culver City offices. Originally from South Africa, she was previously an executive at Pinterest, YouTube, and Sesame Workshop. She does not have a journalism background.
“News as a content type is not where I feel confident,” Zylstra acknowledged. “But thank goodness for [Thomas] Evans, because he’s the editor-in-chief, and actually nobody wants my opinion on what’s the news anyway.”
Instead, Zylstra was tasked with helping NPR bloom in the next digital era. No one — especially not Nieman Lab readers — will be surprised to learn that involves video.
“We were always audio-first. But as you move into the digital world, you have to turn the lights on, right?” Zylstra said. “You can’t be in the digital world without video being part of the experience.”
Machine Gods is not NPR’s first video-first show. Wild Card and Newsmakers (and Tiny Desk Concerts, for that matter) all precede it. But acquiring the popular podcast may help NPR as it seeks to shift from “reaching people wherever they are” to nudging users toward NPR’s own platforms. NPR CEO Katherine Maher described third-party platforms as the “top of the funnel” in a recent interview and has directed funds toward overhauling NPR’s own app.
The press release calls Machine Gods a “major programming acquisition,” but Zylstra said she prefers the term “partnership.” NPR will pay Roose and Newton, who each own half of Machine Gods Media, and then sell sponsorships on the podcast and “all the various touchpoints” for the show, as Zylstra put it. (NPR declined to comment on the price and duration of the partnership. Bloomberg had previously reported the deal was approaching $5 million.) Machine Gods will get wide distribution and help with ad sales while staying independent. The twice-weekly video podcast will debut as a radio show next year — allowing the journalists to reach some of the roughly 33% of Americans who never or rarely listen to podcasts.
NPR, meanwhile, gets a built-in audience and a popular show focused on one of the biggest news stories in the world — plus a partnership that brings proven, solidly journalistic (read: relatively brand-safe) creators into the NPR fold.
Acquiring and distributing an external podcast like Machine Gods is a bit of departure for NPR, which has often chosen to elevate in-house talent or expand existing franchises. Two other launches, announced alongside the Machine Gods partnership, fall into that more familiar pattern.
- The new show Your Turn with Allison Aubrey, also scheduled for a mid-October debut, was created with Boston-based member station WBUR. Aubrey, a longtime health and science correspondent for NPR, will help listeners discover their “third turn” in midlife and beyond.
- The Indicator from Planet Money is an expansion of (you guessed it) NPR’s Planet Money franchise. The weekend show will bring the show’s “signature exuberant explainers to pop culture trends” later this year.
During its four-year run with The New York Times, Hard Fork didn’t shy away from critical reporting, covering decision-making at tech companies as well as federal inaction on AI and other tech regulation. The news analysis from Newton and Roose, two well-connected and thoughtful journalists, was one of the strongest aspects of the show. (Other strengths, in this frequent listener’s opinion: the show is genuinely funny, and the co-hosts can productively disagree.)
I asked Zylstra how she is thinking about the news analysis element when much of NPR’s journalism is delivered with a just-the-facts straightness.
“I think our mandate is to be deeply reported and to express that in a way that represents our voice, and the guys’ journalism fits that perfectly,” she said. “It might have more of a op-ed spirit because there is more opinion in there than some of our news magazines — but that’s not where we are delivering headlines. We’re putting it in the context of a conversation between two friends in the same way that Car Talk would have. I feel like there’s space for both styles.”
In the original announcement, Newton said keeping Machine Gods free and widely accessible was a deciding factor in choosing NPR. “What sold us on NPR is its public-service mission,” Newton said. “We get to bring sharp, independent reporting on AI to millions of people for free, right where they already listen.”
Zylstra thinks NPR’s distribution could be a competitive advantage in future deals, too, as she tries to land more “big-swing” partnerships. New episodes of Machine Gods will appear on the NPR app, yes, but also YouTube, Apple Podcasts, and more. In January, the series will expand into an hour-long radio program distributed across NPR member stations.
Part of the power of public media, Zylstra said, is that its mandate is to distribute its journalism to as many people as possible.
“We don’t have the same [need to say], ‘We need to put it behind a paywall to drive subscription in order to blah blah blah blah,'” she said.
Member stations can choose when (and if) they’ll air Machine Gods. “I’m hoping they do it after [All Things Considered] in a kind of late-night vibe,” Zylstra mused.
